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Thread: FBO M5 vs FBO C63 Coupe
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07-16-2014, 01:28 AM #76
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07-16-2014, 02:32 AM #77
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C'mon man bean driving performance cars all my life, my car for close to 40k and always something up very sensitive car already change clutch 10k miles ago and you telling me idk to take care of it... It's ok
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07-16-2014, 12:04 PM #78
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07-17-2014, 07:55 PM #79
Actually if anything the 6MT on the S85 platform is a POS. Its a after thought that was just thrown at the car.Same trans thats in the normal bmw cars, straight off a 5 or 6 series car. M division actually never wanted to ever use any type of manually trans on this car, but bmw pushed them provide one for the U.S. market because there was a few guys who wanted it. No where else in the world. So they took the normal bmw 5/6 series trans and put it on the car.
The SMG was actually specifically designed by M division to run with the S85.. It has better gear ratios suited to this engines power, and shifts faster then any 6MT or human can. 06/07 had the most smg problems but they were all recalled specific parts and changes within those years.. 08+ are pretty strong, but the 09/10 are the best SMG examples since they have the most up to date smg parts and software, the are pretty bulletproof.. Now a clutch is a clutch, if you abuse it, do launch control or burnout mode alot, there is only so much a clutch can take.. Anyone who drives a manual will know this of course.
09/10 also have the strongest engine of all the S85's with the new type of 702/703 rod bearings that last and dont have the poor material the old 88/89 bearings like the 06/07/08 engines have.
09/10 motors also have two oil drain plugs ( compared to 1 like older years) This is done to get more old oil out esp by the rod bearings, stronger main bolts that connect to main engine block, new/better pistion/cylinder oil jets, etc along with the latest vanos lines, solenoids, pump, gears and vanos units.
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07-17-2014, 11:29 PM #80
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07-17-2014, 11:39 PM #81
So how's this thread going?
BRAND NEW IN BOX 991.2 standard/non-pse SPW cat bypass pipe for sale - $899 shipped
New generic 991.2 PSE bypass pipes - $499 shipped
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07-17-2014, 11:40 PM #82
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07-17-2014, 11:53 PM #83
come on, in terms of reliability and practicality, SMG is garbage. yes in terms of performance it is superior to the 6MT.
the only 2 things that make the SMG superior is the shift speed and the 7 gears which makes low end accelaration quicker, which you would think would be better for the 6mt high end but BMW figured it out
they still have had software issues, you're victim to that. how much did you have to pay when you took it to the dealer that day (i think it was may 2013?) and do all that headache with the adaptation procedure?
the difference is the 702/703s aren't leaded like the old ones. they still aren't invincible to wear, Troy has even told us that
this is true
i've driven SMG with Euro software and a fresh new clutch and flywheel and adaptation and i still prefer my 6mt any day. the SMG is the more capable trans but it isn't built to take abuse all day. 6mt can..
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07-18-2014, 07:47 AM #84
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07-19-2014, 12:00 AM #85
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Exactly this...
I wholeheartedly agree that SMG is superior to the 6 speed box. ESPECIALLY in the S85 powered cars - where the transmission and engine were designed to work "in harmony" as a unit. It was not designed around the 6 speed, it was designed around the SMG transmission. In other words, the car was designed and engineered from the factory to be as quick/reliable/etc. as possible using this transmission. It is an "afterthought" that the 6 speed is available.
I get the "hate" of the SMG though - but to be honest, nearly all of the issues I had were solved. I wouldn't even call them issues - it was a software update/bulletin here or there, but the clutch/transmission was literally bulletproof. I abused the F*** out of that car, and it ran the same as it did when I bought it as when I traded up to the new M3 (I regret this, should have kept it and had both). I will buy an E46 M3 with SMG again - it's just a matter of having a parking spot at this point. I live in Chicago, and have to pay more than the value of the car itself just to keep it indoors; it's ridiculous.
Many of the "complaints" around SMG were from customers that would shift the transmission and think that the TCU would do "everything" and make it a perfect shift (no shift shock/jerk/etc). Although the car could perfectly handle this jerk/shock/jolt (whatever you want to call it) - customers hated it. However, most people didn't realize that a little bit of throttle manipulation between the gears made for a perfect shift. I could get in an M5 or M3 with SMG, blindfold and put hearing protection on you - and almost guarantee you wouldn't know if you were in a 6 speed car or an SMG. You could "manipulate" the shift with the throttle at partial loads, and that was something that wasn't communicated well from BMW - and it's a damn shame. I loved that car, and loved the gearbox.
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07-19-2014, 01:29 AM #86
S85 based SMG M cars: most towed BMWs to date, current record holder
lolit's true BMW figured it out in the late model cars but by the time they figured out something was wrong (despite the thousands of warranty claims on SMG trans) they came out with the DCT on the M3, which kinda sucks
i do wish the 6MT worked better with the S85, M should have released 6MT from the start. you can tell they figured that out when we saw the F10 M5 had the DCT as an option and not standard. more money + demand is there. really i find it hard to believe that no one in Europe hated the SMG and wanted a man's transmission. the MT used to be one of the biggest things in M cars, like when the E39 M5 only came in manual.. but whatever times have changed coulda shoulda woulda
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07-19-2014, 11:17 AM #87
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No offense, but what you are saying is what's wrong with the world of cars.
This is the type of thinking that "forces" BMW to create a car with a manual option - just to appease the USA.
We are the only country where we have people that equate driving a 6 speed manual transmission with "being a man" or "macho" - it's the most RIDICULOUS $#@! in the world. Driving a 6 speed (even driving one WELL) takes virtually no skill, and is not "special" - however, in the US, we have concluded that it is. Everywhere else, where the 6 speed HAS BEEN around forever - they laugh. They DO NOT WANT this crap anymore; there are BETTER technologies - and countries like Europe (who do not equate a 6 speed with virtual c**k size) "get it", while we bitch and moan - and FORCE BMW to give us a slower, substandard option (think about that) - just so we can prance around and say "oh, I have a real man's manual" in the forums/to your cousin/etc...
So, in other words - it's not about driving what's the best anymore, it's about what's cute in the parking lot. $#@! that. I am sorry man, but I have been driving a 6 speed since I started driving - it doesn't take much skill. There is nothing manly about it. Soon enough, we will catch up - and the forum wars will end in regard to the "manly transmission" - and people will just "understand" that there is better technology out there. It's so silly to give a $#@! what other people think about YOUR CAR.
I want the fastest shifting option possible. Period. I give 0 cares to what people think is more "manly" - that's ridiculous. It pisses me off to be honest. We bitched and moaned - and BMW catered to us (threw a 6 speed option in). We should be BITCHING and MOANING for the GTS or CSL - and instead get that. But no, we need a "man's transmission" - not a race car.
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07-19-2014, 11:22 AM #88
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And just to be clear, this is not an attack against you @rawad1017 - this is just a /rant on the "manly" transmission remarks that everyone seems to continue even after the age of SMG/DSG. It's like saying I would rather have fireplaces rather than lightbulbs in my house because it's more manly. It just makes no sense to me. It's not logical, and again - pisses me off.
On another note, the reason there were so many warranty claims (again, here in this country) is due to the "jerkiness" of the transmission. They had to dumb down the clutch (dis)engagement to make us feel better about our purchase (sadly, people buy an M3 expecting a Lexus) - because people didn't understand that moving your right foot (throttle) between shifts was the key to a smooth shift. You do know that the mechanical gearbox is EXACTLY THE SAME between the M3 6 speed and the M3 SMG, right? One has a hydraulically actuated clutch, the other doesn't. The gearbox is exactly the same though.Last edited by inlineS54B32; 07-19-2014 at 11:30 AM. Reason: are vs our && left vs right... omg, mornings suck
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07-19-2014, 12:13 PM #89
lol the man's transmission comment was a joke, anyway don't forget there is a market for those who don't necessarily want to be the fastest and want to enjoy their car, and 6mt is the way to go IMO. there is just no way that no one in Europe wanted a 6mt, why bmw never released it anywhere else is beyond me
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07-19-2014, 12:15 PM #90
lol its all good man but the most warranty claims came from the guys who were left stranded on the side of the road because the smg would get stuck in 1st gear and not move, car wouldn't turn on, limp mode, etc. the jerkiness of the transmission was just a complaint and you have to keep doing SMG adaptation to fix it all the time
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07-19-2014, 02:21 PM #91
I would love to see data or a link to this, because N54 engines and my two 335i's owned within 7 years had 5X times the problems of my M5 in the past 2 years... Failed open injector, fuel pump, lpfp, cracked charge pipe, misfires, dead coils, smoking turbos, etc. As much as i loved it.. And the amount of 335i's on the road is probably 5X the number of M5's/M6's.
+1'd!
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07-19-2014, 04:19 PM #92
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07-21-2014, 09:49 PM #93
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Yeah, I feel ya. I think although the transmission itself is pretty bulletproof, there were some software issues that a lot of people were "told" to get - and I do know of a few people that had the pump/actuator go out. I don't know much on the statistics (re: how many failures for manual vs how many for SMG). Point is, I think it's a superior transmission (especially for a car like this... I wouldn't think it fly in an Accord or something) - even though it had a few issues. By the time SMG III was out, the thing was basically "perfect" - and then along came DSG.
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